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	<title>Comments on: Christians and Deadly Force: In Support of Just War Doctrine</title>
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	<link>http://www.fishingtheabyss.com/archives/488</link>
	<description>Living close enough to the edge to matter...</description>
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		<title>By: Dave Muller</title>
		<link>http://www.fishingtheabyss.com/archives/488/comment-page-1#comment-95782</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Muller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Jan 2010 22:20:13 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Sorry about the double post.  I put &quot;Al-Qaeda&quot; in there instead of &quot;Taliban&quot;.  

I didn&#039;t mean to argue so much and the main point is that I disagree but you have many good verses to back up your position that I need to consider.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry about the double post.  I put &#8220;Al-Qaeda&#8221; in there instead of &#8220;Taliban&#8221;.  </p>
<p>I didn&#8217;t mean to argue so much and the main point is that I disagree but you have many good verses to back up your position that I need to consider.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris L.</title>
		<link>http://www.fishingtheabyss.com/archives/488/comment-page-1#comment-95769</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris L.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Jan 2010 16:45:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fishingtheabyss.com/?p=488#comment-95769</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;but in my view pacifism (or specifically a classically liberal government) would have prevented it from getting there to begin with.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
I agree - but by the time 1941 rolled around, such options were long off the table.   I agree that a lot more intelligence and forethought today, rather than expedient solutions, will save much more undesirable decisions in the coming years.  Even so, this does not account for the actions outside of our control...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>but in my view pacifism (or specifically a classically liberal government) would have prevented it from getting there to begin with.</p></blockquote>
<p>I agree &#8211; but by the time 1941 rolled around, such options were long off the table.   I agree that a lot more intelligence and forethought today, rather than expedient solutions, will save much more undesirable decisions in the coming years.  Even so, this does not account for the actions outside of our control&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Muller</title>
		<link>http://www.fishingtheabyss.com/archives/488/comment-page-1#comment-95749</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Muller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Jan 2010 06:20:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fishingtheabyss.com/?p=488#comment-95749</guid>
		<description>I understand where you are coming from, but in my view pacifism (or specifically a classically liberal government) would have prevented it from getting there to begin with. The only reason the Nazi party rose up was the war debt and embargoes against Germany.  Al-Qaeda was created as an unintentional consequence when the West got involved in the Afghan war and funded freedom fighters.  In both cases, what would be considered a just war (to which I partially agree) could have never happened with no war.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I understand where you are coming from, but in my view pacifism (or specifically a classically liberal government) would have prevented it from getting there to begin with. The only reason the Nazi party rose up was the war debt and embargoes against Germany.  Al-Qaeda was created as an unintentional consequence when the West got involved in the Afghan war and funded freedom fighters.  In both cases, what would be considered a just war (to which I partially agree) could have never happened with no war.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Muller</title>
		<link>http://www.fishingtheabyss.com/archives/488/comment-page-1#comment-95750</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Muller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Jan 2010 06:20:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fishingtheabyss.com/?p=488#comment-95750</guid>
		<description>I understand where you are coming from, but in my view pacifism (or specifically a classically liberal government) would have prevented it from getting there to begin with. The only reason the Nazi party rose up was the war debt and embargoes against Germany.  Al-Qaeda was created as an unintentional consequence when the West got involved in the Afghan war and funded freedom fighters.  In both cases, what would be considered a just war (to which I partially agree) could have never happened with no war.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I understand where you are coming from, but in my view pacifism (or specifically a classically liberal government) would have prevented it from getting there to begin with. The only reason the Nazi party rose up was the war debt and embargoes against Germany.  Al-Qaeda was created as an unintentional consequence when the West got involved in the Afghan war and funded freedom fighters.  In both cases, what would be considered a just war (to which I partially agree) could have never happened with no war.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris L.</title>
		<link>http://www.fishingtheabyss.com/archives/488/comment-page-1#comment-95747</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris L.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Jan 2010 05:35:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fishingtheabyss.com/?p=488#comment-95747</guid>
		<description>Dave,

The purpose of just war doctrine is to prevent unjust wars from occurring, not to try and justify a war in advance.  War fits within the purview of the responsibility given to governments, as God&#039;s servants.  While I think that many Christians have swung the pendulum too far towards considering violence an answer, I&#039;m not sure the solution is to swing it equally as far in the opposite direction.

I believe that WWII met the criteria for &lt;em&gt;Jus ad bellum&lt;/em&gt; (the declaration of war), but that there were a number of instances where &lt;em&gt;Jus en bellum&lt;/em&gt; (conduct in war) was not properly met (like the firebombing of Dresden), and that &lt;em&gt;Jus post bellum&lt;/em&gt; was met, particularly in the reparations made to Germany and Japan.  Whlie I believe it could have been staved off in the 1920&#039;s and early 1930&#039;s, by the time Hitler&#039;s invasions had begun, there was no other viable solution.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dave,</p>
<p>The purpose of just war doctrine is to prevent unjust wars from occurring, not to try and justify a war in advance.  War fits within the purview of the responsibility given to governments, as God&#8217;s servants.  While I think that many Christians have swung the pendulum too far towards considering violence an answer, I&#8217;m not sure the solution is to swing it equally as far in the opposite direction.</p>
<p>I believe that WWII met the criteria for <em>Jus ad bellum</em> (the declaration of war), but that there were a number of instances where <em>Jus en bellum</em> (conduct in war) was not properly met (like the firebombing of Dresden), and that <em>Jus post bellum</em> was met, particularly in the reparations made to Germany and Japan.  Whlie I believe it could have been staved off in the 1920&#8217;s and early 1930&#8217;s, by the time Hitler&#8217;s invasions had begun, there was no other viable solution.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Muller</title>
		<link>http://www.fishingtheabyss.com/archives/488/comment-page-1#comment-95738</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Muller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Jan 2010 00:50:18 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>A good post with many things to consider.  I loved the &quot;no weapons poster&quot;.  I generally agree with you except on just war.  IMO there is close to no reason to ever go to war, including WWII, which was the creation of Western foreign policy.  I do agree with force being used for personal defence.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A good post with many things to consider.  I loved the &#8220;no weapons poster&#8221;.  I generally agree with you except on just war.  IMO there is close to no reason to ever go to war, including WWII, which was the creation of Western foreign policy.  I do agree with force being used for personal defence.</p>
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